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Post by gerifalte on Apr 7, 2008 21:28:14 GMT -5
Thousands of American tractor owners would like to slow down their Jinma 354 tractors, having a slower speed gear kit available would make you a hero and bring you good fortune. FUNNY!! You made me laugh. A mix of fortune cookie and Confucius philosophy, with an American twist ha ha ;D Bob, I hope china-man can help you with the parts. Great thread you started, and you certainly have a beautiful family! G |
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 8, 2008 11:10:34 GMT -5
Hello friends
I took Larry's proposed email and sent to Mr. Alan. Here is Mr. Alan's response.
I have not figured out exactly how this would change speed, but basically it would change speed of all gears by changing speed of final drive ratio to rear wheels.
Bob
Please note: This post has been edited. I mistakenly had entered the wrong email reply from Mr. Alan in the box above. Therefore, the next responses to this post are a little confusing. Instead of putting in Mr. Alan's latest reply I copied his orignal reply. What follows is what I mistakenly posted the first time.
Sorry gang
Bob
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3RRL
Administrator 
Huge Kama
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 8, 2008 11:24:34 GMT -5
If the entire gearing was changed AND the rear tires are changed to accomplish that, what about the 4x4 front drive?
How is the front drive connected/geared to the transmission through the transfer case? Would a change of rear tires require a change of front tires to keep the 4x4 rear-front ratio the same? Has to be constant like it is now, right? I would think a change of the fronts would be required too.
I wonder if Mr.Allen is talking about a 2 wheel drive?
Rob-
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 8, 2008 11:41:12 GMT -5
Rob,
Great point! This all makes sense now.
The front drive is connected to the front of the pinion shaft. The rear drive is connected to rear of pinion shaft. Therefore, either the front or rear tires would have to be changed to keep ratio correct. This is why Mr Alan is saying that tires would have to be changed.
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quikduk
CTW Life Member
Dog House
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Post by quikduk on Apr 8, 2008 16:57:36 GMT -5
Waitaminute! If the drivelines are connected to either end of the pinion shaft and the respective pinion and ring gears aren't changed, just the reverse gear pair, what would you have to change anything else for? I can change any gearing or swap transmissions in a 4x4 and the differential ratios do not change. Maybe the final drive ratio changes by say going from a 3-speed to a 4-speed with OD but the front and rear diffs don't change. You only re-gear differentials if your choice of tires makes the vehicle too slow or too fast off the line or for say rock crawling etc. I must be missing something...again.  |
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GuglioLS
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Jinma354 LE
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Post by GuglioLS on Apr 8, 2008 19:22:35 GMT -5
Now there Is option available for slower speed reverse in high gear.And the tires need be changed.Mr Allan keeps repeating this - is he ever going to give us the part #'s to order them? Could it be that Mr Allan is really a "Chat Bot"?I'm not buying the tire size change, the only other tires sizes for the rears are narrower ones. Mine are 11.2X24 the other option in Ag tires are 9.5X24 (Narrower, same OD), I think those are the ones on a 284, 254, 224, or 204? Maybe ask only one question at a time, perhaps that will help narrow it down: Dear Mr Allan, What are part numbers to slow down reverse in high range for Jinma 354? Thank you... Larry
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GuglioLS
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Jinma354 LE
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Post by GuglioLS on Apr 8, 2008 19:31:49 GMT -5
Waitaminute! If the drivelines are connected to either end of the pinion shaft and the respective pinion and ring gears aren't changed, just the reverse gear pair, what would you have to change anything else for?
EXACTLY! there is no reason to change tires sizes. If only the gearing in the transmission is changed, that's it, your done. The output shaft is the same for both the rear-end drive and the front transfer case, those two are driven off either end of the same output shaft.
Larry
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 8, 2008 19:47:24 GMT -5
Ok maybe I am not thinking right. For simplicity, lets say both front and rear tires are same size. Then lets say for every 100 rotations of pinion shaft lets say the rear tires rotate 10 times and front tires rotate 10 times. Now lets say I change gearing in final drive to slow rear tires down to 8 times per 100 rotatations of pinion shaft.
It seems I would either have to change tire size, or gearing for front drive. Otherwise the front would be going faster than the rear!!
I think what you are missing is the gearing change is taken place in final drive assembly, not the transmission
Bob
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 8, 2008 20:23:35 GMT -5
OOPS!
I screwed up. Just realized this when Larry mentioned that Mr. Alan was a chat bot. I copied wrong email from Mr. Alan. Here is his new reply.
I will go back an edit my previous post.
Bob
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GuglioLS
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Post by GuglioLS on Apr 8, 2008 21:56:18 GMT -5
OK Mr Allan is not a Chat Bot, I was a little worried there when he seemed to keep saying the same thing over and over. Interesting - If I under stand all this correctly the real reason for the final drive gear options in the parts book are to accommodate the OD difference of turf tires v.s. Ag tires. Not the answer I was hoping for, but it does explain that part of it anyway. Too bad there does not seem to be as easy way to slow down the Reverse speed in H range  . Over the years I think I have seen a few 354 owners wanting to switch to turf tires, Now I wonder if they understand the implications in that it's not just a simple matter of swapping tires. Bob - In our conversation last night, I believe the conclusion is the double geared reverse idler I sent you is meant for the single stage clutch, which I'm not sure they make anymore? The gears, speed and shift pattern between the single stage clutch and the dual stage clutch option are completely different. That is why there are all those different gears, shifter forks and other options to choose from in the parts book. Which leads me to believe any attempt to install that double geared reverse idler would be a waste of your time. Now that I think of it, even if that gear did fit, it would slow down the reverse speed in Lo range as well, something that would be unacceptable. An option to slow down the entire high range, while maintaining the speed of the entire low range would be more acceptable. IMHO they need to re-gear the entire transmission to slow down the high range speed, while reducing the speed of reverse. Some sort of compromise from the way it's geared at present would make a huge improvement, as it is now, High range is useful for highway speeds to transport the tractor from point A to point B as quickly as possible, and not useful for any ground engaging or FEL work. I will continue to use my 354 in low range for most tasks and leave it at that. I thank you from the bottom of my heart for all your time and effort in working with Mr. Allan, and posting all your findings in pursuit of my ambition to improve the overall performance of a Jinma 354 transmission for all owners. To that end, I look forward to you getting your tranny back together with some great pictures and documentation to follow you along. This is a great thread on the tear-down and reassembly of the entire rear 1/2 of the drive line. So keep up the good work! Did you get all the parts needed to start your re-assembly? Larry |
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 8, 2008 23:59:18 GMT -5
Larry, You wrote: Jerry @ Affordable shipped parts out Monday afternoon. Last time he sent them USPS Priority and I had in two days. This was bigger order and I forgot to ask how they were coming. Hopefully, they might be here tomorrow. Also, here is picture of pinion shaft and circlip grove. Unfortunately, it came out a little blury.  I would retake, but I have already taken the bearing and pressed it back onto shaft. I did notice that the only way circlip will go in grove is if the bearing is pressed completely onto end of shaft. Here are some more pictures. The first two are just getting ready to press the bearing onto shaft. The third is another view of circlip grove after bearing is on. The fourth is just complete shot of pinion shaft and bearing. Bob |
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Post by sokkerbob on Apr 10, 2008 23:50:06 GMT -5
Our parts have arrived and we have started reassembly of tractor.
There have been times when we thought we had everything right and then realized we could not proceed because we did not think ahead. We have also discovered some steps in disassembly that can be changed to make reassembly easier. After doing this several times, we decided just to slow down and smell the coffee.
Since we have found ourselves backtracking, I have decided to wait until tractor is completely reassembled before I give you the blow by blow account.
Otherwise, this post would end up being "100 ways on How NOT to Replace the Pinion Bearing"
FYI. We took a careful look and found no brass or bronze in the entire transmission, differential, and final drive.
Also, Larry's reverse idler gear does not worked as hoped. It is obvious that this gear is for a completely different gearbox. After further examination of parts manual, we pretty much figured out that this gear was for tractors with a single stage clutch.
Bob
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Post by john1949 on Aug 3, 2020 22:19:39 GMT -5
Hello everyone, I have been reader of this forum (and previous) since I purchased my Jinma 354 about a year and half ago. Thanks to all of you for all your excellent advice, mods, etc. I have a problem that I need some help with. While I was working on tractor, it started popping out of low gear. Eventually, it would not even go into low gear. I talked to Tommy @ Affordable and Ronald @ Ranch Hand Supply and they both suspected a bent shifting fork. Well, it turned out it is not the shifting fork, but the pinion bearing has started coming out of the case and is preventing the sliding gear from engaging. We suspect the circlip in front of the bearing is probably the culprit. My brother and I have split the tractor and removed the lifter box in order to have a good look. What we need help on is procedure for disassembling the transmission. Does anybody know how to remove the upper and lower shaft in the transmission? Any ideas or thoughts would be appreciated. Bob |
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. Over the years I think I have seen a few 354 owners wanting to switch to turf tires, Now I wonder if they understand the implications in that it's not just a simple matter of swapping tires.
