GuglioLS
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Jinma354 LE
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Post by GuglioLS on Apr 19, 2008 1:25:16 GMT -5
You know my luck with bad connections, right? ;D I might need a buddy to come over and help with this now that it's Spring and 80°F here. I'd pay big money to that guy.LOL yea that guy could sure use some big money right now. I know your luck with bad connections, look what it cost you to have me come fix the gremlin ground wire on Huge Kama the first time. I'd love to come out again, hey I've got a business trip at the end of May to San Diego, how far is that from Rancho? Send Surplus center the bill for getting hosed on hoses ouch that must of hurt. Oh yea live swivels cost big $$$. I'm cheap so I purchased the "surplus" ones at a discount, they were a little rusty on the outside but clean as a whistle on the inside, so I lucked out on that deal. Ken and his grapple? Who's Ken? you know it's been almost a year now since your sent me the design and I had his plasma cut. Then 6 months later you modified and welded them up. What is he waiting for? There not going to install themselves. I wonder if he still has a tractor? Larry
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3RRL
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Huge Kama
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 20, 2008 1:47:49 GMT -5
Ken? Yeah, he calls me on my golf days ... every time like clockwork. I know he's working on his grapples though. He's been asking Loretta a lot of questions about it lately.
Hey, San Diego is only 120 miles from Rancho. If you want, I can pick you up and we can goof for a while. Then fly home out of Ontario. I have the family get together planned at the end of May (Memorial weekend) so that might work out perfectly.
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quikduk
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Dog House
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Post by quikduk on Apr 23, 2008 18:54:37 GMT -5
Hey, if I have a 3-day weekend then and if no family obligations come up, maybe we should all go down and bug Brian and Mark. I am working on a host of hyd. repairs and the installation of the meat of the grapple hydraulics so I will be busy for a while. I too looked at the live swivel hose ends and the live swivel adapters. They aren't cheap are they. After talking with Rob a few minutes ago, I am apparently going to have to re-think the hard-line to final grapple hose connections again. I have some spares but I may just have them cut and extra fittings added. Great job on Loretta's grapple! It came out looking very professional!!! I think you should check your voltage at the switch & at the Hirschman connectors to make sure the battery power is getting to them through the switch. BTW, did you install either a relay or an in-line fuse? Ken
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3RRL
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Huge Kama
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 28, 2008 11:46:46 GMT -5
Still no luck with getting Loretta's solenoid valve to work. I brought a volt meter up and checked out the Scorpion Rocker switch and the Hirshman connectors ... they are good and all the grounds are good. Also verified the hydraulic connections in the system and they are all correct. I unplugged the QC's at the solenoid valve and hooked up hoses to my Huge Kama. The grapple works great under Kama's power so I don't know WTF? I even took a hot wire right from the (+) and another wire to ground right to the solenoid terminals while the tractor was running. That procedure took the switch and connectors out of play...still didn't work! Before I worked on testing the solenoid valve, I set all the pressure relief valves, starting with the new main relief valve by unplugging the QC's to the FEL valve. (See posts starting at #120 in this thread My New Jinma). It came factory set around 1350psi. I set it exactly at 16MPa or 2321psi. You could set that at the +.5MPa which would be 2393 but that is max. That Prince relief valve works very smooth and was steady ...responding well during the adjustment. It only took a little over a full turn ionwards (clockwise). Then I set all the other valves at 15.5MPa 2250psi. When I got to the rear remote valve, it was only 1000psi. I adjusted the pressure relief on it several times and never got it up much more than that. In fact, the gauge jumped around between 800 and 1200psi like it was throwing up. I think it's a faulty pressure relief or faulty valve or both. I was afraid to turn it in any more than I did. I need to get Jinma to send me another one. I tried operating the CCM hydraulic top link with DPOCV with her rear remotes and it would barely move the rod out, but trying to suck it back, it didn't budge. I hooked it up to Huge Kama and it worked perfectly. So then I tried the remotes on the dump trailer and it did lift that up while empty. Remember when we used the dump trailer, it did lift it then but really strained to get the load up. It also didn't relieve when I tried to lower the dump trailer like how Scott said his did. It was screwed up then, I guess? I wonder if that valve in the circuit could have anything to do with the solenoid grapple valve not responding? All the other hydraulics on her tractor work great, and that remote valve is the last one in line feeding the 3pt. the solenoid valve is 4th in line right after the old ZL-20 valve which now will power her hydraulic side links. The rear remote valve follows that one. But like I said, all the others work great. Should I move the grapple solenoid valve up the line fed by power beyond from either the new FEL valve or the dump trailer Prince valve? How do I go about checking if the solenoid valve is faulty or not (in detail) with a volt or ohm meter? I tried the direct circuit already. Any suggestions? Rob-
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3RRL
Administrator
Huge Kama
Posts: 2,027
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 28, 2008 14:32:29 GMT -5
When I went to the property this week I tried all those things I posted above, but also noticed then (not before) that it said 110v50 and 120v60 on the ends thinking that might be a problem...just in case. I copied down everything that was on the valve they sent to me. I ordered the 12v model and the shipper shows it's a 12v too. But I wasn't sure if the valve was marked like that or not? I just called Surplus Center to let them know all I tried to get it to work. Then gave them the ID information to them and also about the 110/120v on the valve. When he read me what the ID SHOULD be, it was different than on my valve! So now he's researching that out. I think they sent me the wrong valve in the right box. Heck, I'm only 108v short.
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3RRL
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Huge Kama
Posts: 2,027
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 28, 2008 14:42:52 GMT -5
Well, I just got off the phone with Surplus Center and they are going to make everything right. They are sending out the correct valve and also a prepaid return sticker for the wrong valve.
The number I posted is for the correct 12VDC valve. Item #9-6136 with ID#DG4V-3-8C-VM-U-G7-61. The wrong valve I got is indeed for 115v as verified by their tech. Item #9-7236 with ID#DG4V-3-0C-M-U-B6-60.
Hmmm, although I've wasted a lot of time fiddling with that valve and the hydraulics, at least I know what the REAL problem is now. I asked them to send it out 2nd day air so I can go up this weekend to install it. Videos coming soon! Rob-
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Post by linus69 on Apr 28, 2008 16:37:34 GMT -5
That definitely is a bummer Rob, I remember enough problems to wade through doing this mod. The additional grief caused by a incompetent parts puller is sure not needed, they should look at what they are shipping out a little closer.
Paul
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quikduk
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Dog House
Posts: 552
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Post by quikduk on Apr 28, 2008 16:47:14 GMT -5
Great! Now I need to go and check mine out since I just got it mounted this past weekend...
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3RRL
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Huge Kama
Posts: 2,027
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 28, 2008 17:04:05 GMT -5
That definitely is a bummer Rob, I remember enough problems to wade through doing this mod. The additional grief caused by a incompetent parts puller is sure not needed, they should look at what they are shipping out a little closer. Paul Thanks for the condolences Paul. You're right, it caused a lot of grief. I've spent the last 2 visits to the property trying to get it to work now and all that time was wasted. I just wasn't sure whether or not some valves are marked with 110v but are really 12VDC or not. My grapple solenoid valve on the Kama is a Hyvair valve being different than this Vickers valve. It added to the confusion and I was besides myself with grief and anguish just thinking about the possibility I might have made a mistake in hose routing, electrical connections or something else. I couldn't concentrate for that period and it ruined my golf game. Anyway, with the rear remote valve not working correctly, I was second guessing myself for 2 weeks. I ended up changing several connections to see if routing the hydraulics differently might make a difference. But then, all my other valves worked perfectly (except the rear remote), so I was still unsure. I told you I even hooked up the Kama hydraulics to be sure the grapple function was correct and it wasn't something mechanical I'd screwed up on. All that swapping of hoses and Teflon taping all those friggen NPT threads and then tightening them up was a real pain in the ass! Then loosening them to make other connections just to check it out really pissed me off. I also checked and removed the diodes but in checking them with the switch function, they did not impose a short or anything like that, so they were good to go also and I put them back in again. So I spent a lot of hours checking for nothing. We've got other things to do up there too. It's not like I can go out to the garage to work on the tractor, know what I mean? It's also kept me from posting finished working photos of those beautiful grapples for you guys. I was hoping to have some of Loretta using it to share with you by now. OK, enough of that, when I get the valve, I'll install it and that should be that. Larry was right when said at the beginning of this thread "Grapples from Hell". Rob-
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3RRL
Administrator
Huge Kama
Posts: 2,027
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 28, 2008 18:04:12 GMT -5
Man, what a wise guy. ;D You crack me up. For those of you who have not met Ken in person, it's a real treat. You can ask Larry G if I'm exaggerating or not, but Ken talks so fast, he has enough mouth for 2 sets of teeth. He could could talk the legs off a herd of centipedes! He left me a voice mail last week and I let Loretta listen to it. When it ended, she said, "What did he say?" LOL ... So I called him back and told Loretta "Watch this". I left a message about the grapple install and the main relief valve settings he had asked about, except I talked as fast as I could, you know, like those commercials where they say a whole page in 10 seconds. Anyway, he called back and told me he got everything from the voice mail I left. I said "Did you notice anything funny?" He said "NO". I mean did you notice I was talking really really fast? He said no again, like it was perfectly normal to talk at mach1. We both just busted up after that.
So Ken, check the ID numbers (posted above) on top of that solenoid valve you have to verify they sent you the correct one. What are you going to do with that old Chinese loader valve? Give it to me so I can make a power beyond sleeve for it. And while on the subject, when are you going to finish the thread you started a year ago about your grapple install? Or did you ever even start one? LOL ... We don't want to skip around every thread on the board to find out how you're doing. Just put it all in one. ;D Rob-
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quikduk
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Post by quikduk on Apr 28, 2008 18:30:56 GMT -5
LOL... ;D I did. I have the 9-6136 which is the 12V version. If you check the pic. I posted, it shows the 12V stamp...allthough a bit blurry. Must have had too much coffee... ;D
Done. It is yours...for lunch at Ono... ;D ;D
LOL. I am working on it. It will come after the hydraulics are ready. I am figuring on a few days to bend/fit/bend the hard lines and then I will need to mock it up per your instructions so I can verify that hose length issue I spoke about.
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GuglioLS
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Jinma354 LE
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Post by GuglioLS on Apr 29, 2008 8:33:48 GMT -5
What a PITA, doing all the trouble shooting because of receiving the wrong voltage solenoid. Makes you feel like someone should die Glad you finally figured it out though, that kind of stuff sure can drive you crazy. I look forward to seeing Loretta's grapple in action and I bet you do too! No doubt this was the grapple from hell. Larry
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3RRL
Administrator
Huge Kama
Posts: 2,027
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Post by 3RRL on Apr 29, 2008 9:07:01 GMT -5
LOL... ;D I did. I have the 9-6136 which is the 12V version. If you check the pic. I posted, it shows the 12V stamp...allthough a bit blurry. Must have had too much coffee... Well, it doesn't have those numbers on the solenoid valve itself. That is the Surplus Center ITEM number ... which I ordered, then the same item number appeared on my confirming email, and again on the delivery receipt. So I thought I got the right one too. But the valve itself was the wrong one. The number you are looking for is printed on the solenoid valve itself. It should be DG4V-3-8C-VM-U-G7-61. That confirms it is the 12v model along with the 12v or something written on the ends of each solenoid where mine said 110v50, 120v60. But how many times have you seen labels like that which are not necessarily correct ... or don't "really" apply for all? Like those safety labels "Wear Safety Goggles when using this pencil sharpener" etc. or like the John Deere labels which say "Made in USA". In your case, like every speed limit sign. Rob-
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3RRL
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Huge Kama
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Post by 3RRL on May 5, 2008 14:53:54 GMT -5
Good news for Loretta. Surplus Center sent out the correct valve and it arrived last Thursday. We drove up to camp for a couple reasons, to install that valve and get her grapple going, but also to clear some camp spots for the Memorial day camp out at our place. Here is what the 2 valves look like together. The 110v/120v valve is smaller than the 12v valve. You can clearly see the difference in marking. It only took a few minutes to switch the valves. Now she is ready to go.
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